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47 replies
USA down to Obama and McCain -- who's it gonna be?
Don
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McCain’s issue will be his deteriorating health, and DNC talk points will at first refer to this as his “age” and then get progressively more nasty as election day draws nigh.

I think Obama will be the next President of US and A. He’s got a lot of momentum, and at this point he’ll either have to be caught with in bed with a dead woman or a live boy in order to lose this election.

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You’re delusional, Clinton’s got it locked.

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I have to go with Don on this one.  McCain Vs. Obama.
 
I think Obama will win but it will be closer than many think.  Obama will come under fire for not being known for much other than being a good public speaker.  Lets be honest, many people who are voting for him can’t tell you anything he has accomplished. 
 
McCain has almost the opposite problem, conservatives dont like his position on immigration (which he is trying to now back away from) and prior alliances with Kennedy. 

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To be doing this well this early, Obama seems impressive.
But I suppose, looking at how it’s early days yet, something could happen and it all might come crashing to a halt.

This guy says that mathematically, Hillary Clinton is toast.
“She can’t catch us”

“It’s not about votes, it’s about delegates.”

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wait, are we talking about Hillary?  How can a girl be president?

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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Cil

To be doing this well this early, Obama seems impressive.
But I suppose, looking at how it’s early days yet, something could happen and it all might come crashing to a halt.

This guy says that mathematically, Hillary Clinton is toast.
“She can’t catch us”

“It’s not about votes, it’s about delegates.”

Politics don’t necessarily follow the rules of finite mathematics.   Yes, something could happen and it won’t surprise me when the Clinton-Obama contest makes it to the floor of the Convention in August.   There could be a movement (by Clinton supporters) to release ‘Caucus’ States’ Delegates from commitment to either Candidate.   Michigan and Florida don’t have any commited Delegates – these are Big States Population (and delegate) wise. 
 
Neither Clinton nor Obama will have the votes for the Nomination before the Convention.   Neither is about to win by acclamation the first few roll call votes.   It’s going to be an interesting Convention! 
 
The title of this thread (USA down to Obama and McCain) disturbs me.  On the Republican side, I like Huckabee over McCain.   Clinton is still fighting Obama on the Democratic side and the Clintons can be pretty tough opponents for a ‘rookie’ like Obama.   He hasn’t taken on a pair of Arkansawyers like Hillary and Bill Clinton in his lifetime.   In Biblical terms:  he needs to ‘gird his loins.’       

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Politicians are almost as useful as reality TV shows…

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Some reality TV shows are really good.

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ORIGINAL: IrishNed


Politics don’t necessarily follow the rules of finite mathematics.   Yes, something could happen and it won’t surprise me when the Clinton-Obama contest makes it to the floor of the Convention in August.Neither Clinton nor Obama will have the votes for the Nomination before the Convention.   Neither is about to win by acclamation the first few roll call votes.   It’s going to be an interesting Convention!  

I completely agree.



I could see this year’s Democratic convention becoming another Chicago ’68.
I’m serious.
[=“1”]edited for messed-up quotes[/]

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Obama looks to be in victory lane but I wouldn’t call him a lock for the White House. 
 
His track record in the Senate isn’t very good.  He misses a lot of votes and he’s not behind any major legislation. 
 
He claims he will end the war in Iraq which could backfire as the plan he laid out early in the primaries would have troops there until 2012/13.  If this war is to continue why wouldn’t people vote for McCain who believes in the mission?  Obama cannot be a moral booster for troops in Iraq.
 
Universal Health Care sounds great but how will he pay for it?  Raise taxes?  I can’t speak for everyone else but I don’t know if I could afford highter taxes.
 
His Chicago connection could come back to haunt him with the Tony Rezko housing scandal.
 
I dunno.  We’ll see how it all falls into place.  He seems like a good guy and he’s not part of the Old Boy’s Club that dominates U.S. politics.  A fresh face, even one with very little experience, could do us good.
 

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Ok, on a side not, did anyone see the google ad that popped up on the right side with Hillary’s head in a crystal ball?  C’mon McCain, a little too dirty a little too early, eh?

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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Cil

Quote:
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… It’s going to be an interesting Convention!  

I completely agree.

I could see this year’s Democratic convention becoming another Chicago ’68.
I’m serious.
Yesterday, there was talk (among Obama supporters?) of Hillary ‘bowing out.’   That’s not gonna happen!
 
Yes, there’s gonna be a floor fight at the Convention!   One reason would be the disenfranchisement of Florida and Michigan Voters:  They weren’t allowed to participate in the Candidate selection process because their States wanted to be First.  And their State Legislatures enacted laws to enable that.   Should the Democratic National Comittee (DNC) be allowed to override State Law?
 
The DNC prohibited prospective candidates from campaigning in either of those States;  but the States went ahead with their early Primaries anyway. 
 
The Stage is set for a knock down, drag out floor fight at the Convention []  

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If the Democrats can’t run primaries what makes them think they can run a country…..
 
The Democrats made there decision about Michigan and Florida.  They can’t go back to appease Hillary now.  Can you say “backlash”?  But this could be a disaster worth watching.

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As usual in my lifetime, at least since Ronald Reagan – there is NO GOOD CHOICE!  They are all moronic, self-serving, sit-on-the-fence & wait & see, typical politicians.  Any one of them would sell their mom’s for 2 or 3 pct. of the vote.

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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Sunskin

As usual in my lifetime, at least since Ronald Reagan – there is NO GOOD CHOICE!  They are all moronic, self-serving, sit-on-the-fence & wait & see, typical politicians.  Any one of them would sell their mom’s for 2 or 3 pct. of the vote.

Yes!  If I could I would select ‘None of the above!   Maybe Al Gore will jump into the Democratic race’; or NY’s Mayor Bloomberg will get on the ballot as an Independent:  I’d like to see an Independent ticket with Bloomberg and Ron Paul.   I would throw that lever 

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So many educated people like ROn Paul.  It amazes me that he only gets about 5% of the vote…  Wait a minute, no it does not…  Only 5% of the people in the screwed-up country have any sense these days!   Bloomberg – maybe…  Al Gore is a half-wit.

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Regan was also a halfwit, Nancy ran the country.

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Quote:
I’d like to see an Independent ticket with Bloomberg and Ron Paul.   I would throw that lever


Never would happen.  Two complete opposites. 

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  Lets be honest, many people who are voting for him can’t tell you anything he has accomplished. 

 
Most voters can’t tell you anything at all about the people running.  They go by what their friends say.

Eat the food, use the wrong verbs, and end up getting charged double.

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Some reality TV shows are really good.

 
And more factual.

Eat the food, use the wrong verbs, and end up getting charged double.

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So many educated people like ROn Paul.  It amazes me that he only gets about 5% of the vote…  Wait a minute, no it does not…  Only 5% of the people in the screwed-up country have any sense these days!   Bloomberg – maybe…  Al Gore is a half-wit.

 
If you like Ron Paul then I highly advise you to read his book A Foreign Policy of Freedom: “Peace, Commerce, And Honest Friendship”
 
It is a collection of his House speeches since the 70s.  All deal with foreign policy as the title states.  His message has not changed in 30 years.  Everything his says would happen down the road has happened.  Sadly, no one seems to hear his message.  In part because no one in the media gives him the time of day.  But I did my part and voted Ron Paul in the Illinois primary.

 [/align]
 

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Electoral Votes
With delegate totals, which might vary a bit according to their source

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Or by what the tv (we bow down to thee, oh mass media!) says…ugh it’s depressing.  I already did pull the Ron Paul lever.  Though so many Republicans claim to believe in downsizing government, I actually think he’d have done something about it.  I vote Libertarian…if Bob in San-Fran wants to be gay, have at it Bob…but if Bob in Washington wants to steal my income to pay for unnecessary shit, no!  Bad Bob…
 
Gov’t should just stay outta stuff. 
 
It’s so funny how so many of you predicted exactly what’s happening right now too!  Obama’s pastoral problems have surfaced; Jeremiah’s a nutcase and people are worried about Obama’s lifelong connection to that (not quite caught red-handed with a dead woman or living boy, but close…haha).  And now that Hillary sees an opening, she’s lobbying for a re-primary in her losing states.  Well called, chaps!  Haha.

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I was reading that McCain might not be able to become pres even if elected since he’s not a natural born American, being born in Panama doesn’t count even if both parents are natural born. It would take a constitutional ammendment or a rulling by the supreme court to get hm in.

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Something we’ve discussed in school: since the voting machines are electronic and involve computer programming, how easy would it be to have someone hack and manipulate the votes?

Eat the food, use the wrong verbs, and end up getting charged double.

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Quote:
I was reading that McCain might not be able to become pres even if elected since he’s not a natural born American, being born in Panama doesn’t count even if both parents are natural born. It would take a constitutional ammendment or a rulling by the supreme court to get hm in.


He Johnny Mac was born in the “Canal Zone” (a former us territory) so he is allowed to be prez.

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The Canal Zone was not a US territory which is why he has this problem.

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ORIGINAL: Cil

Stolen election

Salon.com article.

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Quote:
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Stolen election

Salon.com article.

Yeah, we could go back and forth on this. IMHO the Salon article, like the RS one, has its own slant and omissions.
Reading about Diebold does make me wonder a bit.
However, evidence that the election could be tampered with is not evidence that it has been tampered with.
The fact remains that for the 2004 election, we had 9/11, corrupt Republican fear mongerers, and a crappy Democratic candidate.
That time, Bush was elected, not selected. Didn’t we even have an “October surprise” (a well-timed Bin Laden tape) for that one?
Who knows what will happen this time around.[8D]

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Quote:
The Canal Zone was not a US territory which is why he has this problem.



Do explain.  I was under the assumption that while the canal was under “joint” control between the US and Panama, the strip of land around it was a US controlled territory until Carter gave it back.   American colonialism at it’s finest.

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The Canal Zone is US territory.  You think Mccan would have gotten this far without someone pointing out this glaring fact?

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So by IS do you mean now which it isn’t or does IS mean back when the old fart was born?
 
BTW why the hell would anyone want to vote for a geriatric, I just don’t get it, he’ll probably be dead in a couple of years.

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Dead would make him more qualified than most politicians.

Eat the food, use the wrong verbs, and end up getting charged double.

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heavydrinker wrote:

You’re delusional, Clinton’s got it locked.

I like that comment… about Clinton having it locked… that was funny

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That was indeed a funny prediction! Nobody knows for sure back in Feb. However, I have to say that Obama is doing surprisingly well. I am not sure McCain can get the votes to get in, but I did know that the Americans would not elect that moron Hillary.. Bill did not help her at all by flying off the handle like a whack job during several interviews. The people of the U.S. did not want him back in the White House… mysteriously knock-off his wife, then rule a puppet regime, etc. G. Bush may be an idiot, and Cheney a little scary,,, but, Slick Willie is completely nuts, and his wife is just plain not-likable or trusted.

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I think it’s a tough call. I’d be o.k. with either, because let’s face it, in the day-to-day, it’s not going to make much difference to most people.

McCain’s best line to me, so far, is that although Hamas’s North America grand-poobah said he preferred Obama, McCain said you can bet Hamas would never prefer him.

Obama’s best selling point to me so far is just this idea of hope and change, but honestly, it’s getting a little old. I’m getting “hope fatigue.” He needs to define his platform quickly, or he’ll lose a huge chunk of swing voters who will stick with someone who has a longer and deeper track record.

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Obama’s website lays out his platform pretty well. It’s just that he has to keep updating it over ridiculous stuff such as his birth certificate, or Michelle saying “whitey.”

Someone said Democrats fall in love, and Republicans fall in line.
I’m registered Independent because I’ve been a little fed up with politicians and the entire election process, but I can’t go for McCain and his 100 years in Iraq, that doesn’t sound very moderate to me.
I could be wrong, but as liberal as Obama sounds, I think he might become more moderate once in office.

Yeah, what happened with the Clintons? Both of them really began to freak me out, but I actually liked the speech Hillary finally gave in support of Obama.

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Cil wrote:
McCain and his 100 years in Iraq
Where and when did he say that?

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Thanks for finding and posting that. Here’s what I heard him say:

“Maybe a hundred. We’ve been in South Korea, we’ve been in Japan for 60 years, we’ve been in South Korea for 50 years or so, that’d be fine with me as long as Americans, as long as Americans are not being injured or harmed or wounded or killed, it’s fine with me, I hope it’d be fine with you if we maintain a presence in a very volatile part of the world where Al Quaeda is training, recruiting, and equipping, and motivating people every single day.”

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I think the President of the U.S. is more a symbol than anything else. Obama, McCain, whomever,,, really does not matter… It is all about timing. The economy is horrible right now, and gas is high. Embracing the “change” moniker is probably pretty smart. The average Joe will identify with that, actually thinking that one man can indeed have an impact on the global economy & job market, currency, etc. We all know that the economy was doing well 9 years ago, but Bill Clinton was not responsible for any of that. He simply took the credit for being in office at the right time. Bush may be a moron, but he is not single-handedly responsible for any of the real estate mess, high gas prices, Corporate scandals, jobless rate, etc. These things are way too big for these idiot politicians to actually control, and Bush is no smart enough to fix or break anything in the real world. I will say one thing for Obama,,, he is personable, and I can relateto one MAJOR thing with him… He does seem to have a good deal of common sense. That is not always the case with Lawyers & Politicians, so I like him for that reason…

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Don wrote:
Thanks for finding and posting that. Here’s what I heard him say:

“Maybe a hundred. We’ve been in South Korea, we’ve been in Japan for 60 years, we’ve been in South Korea for 50 years or so, that’d be fine with me as long as Americans, as long as Americans are not being injured or harmed or wounded or killed, it’s fine with me, I hope it’d be fine with you if we maintain a presence in a very volatile part of the world where Al Quaeda is training, recruiting, and equipping, and motivating people every single day.”


Yes. And how do we get to the point of nobody getting killed or wounded, and how much is it going to cost? For me, it is difficult to equate Japan or Korea with the Iraq situation.
Here is another video clip from Wednesday:

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Sunskin wrote:
Bush may be a moron, but he is not single-handedly responsible for any of the real estate mess, high gas prices, Corporate scandals, jobless rate,

Ahem, I think you should do a google search for deregulation – Bush.

Too stupid? The guy has worked in the boardroom of Big Energy for many years and had his
own fair share of golden handshakes and cash kickbacks to know deregulation would help casino capitalism and energy price gouging last for a decade longer than it should have.

Typical stupid american… .knows nothing about their own politics…. europeans know more about
US politics than you thick monkey shitheads!

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Sunskin wrote:
We all know that the economy was doing well 9 years ago, but Bill Clinton was not responsible for any of that. He simply took the credit for being in office at the right time. Bush may be a moron, but he is not single-handedly responsible for any of the real estate mess, high gas prices, Corporate scandals, jobless rate, etc. These things are way too big for these idiot politicians to actually control, and Bush is no smart enough to fix or break anything in the real world. I will say one thing for Obama,,, he is personable, and I can relateto one MAJOR thing with him… He does seem to have a good deal of common sense.

Bush is partially for introducing legislation that can control some of these things. After the Enron scandal, legislation was introduced that was supposed to penalize crooked companies. I haven’t seen anyone penalized. The realestate mess would be less of a mess if companies were required to do a better job educating borrowers and being more selective. One example would be a street worker that I saw on TV. He and his wife made about $40,000 annually and were given a $200,000 loan to buy a house. No way that should happen. Practices like that are way too wide spread here in all aspects of business. American Express gave me a card with an $18,000 limit while I only made $50.00 weekly from work study here in school. No way should they have given me the card with that kind of limit.

Eat the food, use the wrong verbs, and end up getting charged double.