"Must-see" is rather subjective.
Have you looked at any guidebooks or maps yet? Do you have any ideas about where you would like to go? When are you going?
$2,500, for one person, is plenty for a month.
You can see and do a lot in a month, but it would be helpful to develop an itinerary before you figure out transportation or visas.
Hostels can vary, you can read about them (and safes) in the Hostels forum, and get some nightlife ideas in the Nightlife forum.
IMHO Spain would be good for both culture and nightlife.

Ibiza.
Depends what you must see.
Which type—Canadian, Australian, New Zealand, Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan, Bermuda, Bahama, or US dollars?
Which hostels? What is "that nasty"?
Barcelona.
Depends how many places you want to see.
Some. Most have lockable cabinets for each bed in room.
Depends which passport you have. Hungary is part of EU.

lol Don
Great minds think alike.

2500 US Dollars/ Passport

Besides Amsterdam and Barcelona, we really dont have any idea where to start in creating an itinerary. We’re just looking for a goodtime while we’re in europeand since we dont really know any thing, i was wondering if we could get some suggestions on party/ good cultural spots. ive heard things about the greek islands? Also, wheres the cheapest place to fly into and is it smart to bring a laptop/ digicam?

thanks for all your help

I have to ask, if you’re "just looking for a good time" then why does it have to be Europe? What is it you’re expecting from "Europe" to help you have a good time? Maybe those questions will help to target advice about planning.

Flight advice will depend where you’re flying from in the USA.

Bring your digital cameras. I dunno about a laptop. Would depend if you booked lodgings with hotspots included, and if most did, I’d bring one for the group and share responsibility for it.

quote:
We’re just looking for a goodtime while we’re in europeand since we dont really know any thing, i was wondering if we could get some suggestions on party/ good cultural spots.

http://www.eurotrip.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=108390

In addition, you might try running a Google search or looking in a book. As Don said, why go to a place you know nothing about?

I’m just trying to get them to think through some reasons why they want to go so that will help them identify interests that we can match them with destinations and events. If they can’t think of good reasons, then maybe something like a camping roadtrip in the USA would be a better choice(?).

It’s just a lot of money, time, and hassle to spend if you really don’t know what you’re hoping to experience. As wise Mr. Miyagi (of "Karate Kid" movies) said, "If you don’t know where you’re going, any road will take you there." Knowing their basic hopes and desired outcomes for this trip will help us offer better advice so they can craft a good travel plan.

Don’t get me wrong—I think young travel is as much about the adventure and what you learn about yourself and others along the way—but without starting with even a basic plan, it will all quickly become unraveled and they won’t have a good first experience in Europe (IMHO).

If I had to guess, I’d say that their "basic hopes and desires" amount to being on the receiving end of mass quantities of European alcoholic beverages.

"Cultural immersion"?? This trip sounds a bit like Animal House in Europe to me. I suppose there are a few places in Europe where you can act half your age, but yeah, if you’re going to draw up an itinerary based on partying alone, it’s hard to see the point of all the expense and trouble. You can get buzzed anywhere. BevMo has a good assortment of European brews that will save you some cash. Save the trip for a time when you have some other reason to go.

Has anyone ever heard of European teens coming to the US for the sole purpose of &quotartying"?

I don’t mean to pick on you really, acq912. You’re not alone. I guess our ridiculous drinking age laws probably have a lot to do with this "let’s party in Europe" thing. I would guess that the travel industry, which surely sells a lot of European travel to party-happy graduates, actively supports these stupid laws. I don’t see why teens shouldn’t be able to drink at 15 or 16, long as the driving age is a lot higher. I’m sorry that our country has legally denied you this simple pleasure.

I’m always amazed at the disposable income of the typical high school grad these days. After a $1,000 prom night, a senior trip to Maui, senior pictures, and yearbooks, today’s grads still have cash to blow. Maybe they haven’t been to the college bookstore yet to check out the price of textbooks. My daughter’s paperback poli sci text was over $100. Or maybe they have seen the prices and just decided to drink it up instead.

quote:
If I had to guess, I’d say that their "basic hopes and desires" amount to being on the receiving end of mass quantities of European alcoholic beverages.

"Cultural immersion"?? This trip sounds a bit like Animal House in Europe to me. I suppose there are a few places in Europe where you can act half your age, but yeah, if you’re going to draw up an itinerary based on partying alone, it’s hard to see the point of all the expense and trouble. You can get buzzed anywhere. BevMo has a good assortment of European brews that will save you some cash. Save the trip for a time when you have some other reason to go.

Has anyone ever heard of European teens coming to the US for the sole purpose of &quotartying"?

If someone is looking for a trip composed entirely of getting wasted from country to country…so what? You may think it’s ridiculous….you may think it’s shallow…but there can be value in that for some people.

Anyone is entitled to do it..and, although there is much much more to experience than partying…even if one were to only party…there is unique enjoyment in that. A lovely dinner…and some partying in a club in Rome…walking home w/ the colloseum as a backdrop…it’s something that can’t be duplicated in a hometown bar wherever these people are coming from.

Is it a luxury? Sure. Does it raise questions regarding how a kid has the means to fund such a seemingly one dimensional overseas experience? Yeah maybe. But telling someone to "forget it" or "stay home" is really none of your business.

As far as seeing the young Europeans being sent to party in the US…well, I wouldn’t give a shit if I did see it. They can do whatever they want w/ their time and money…god bless them.

Another reason I find it silly to discourage people from travelling due to what you think are superficial reasons for their inspiration…is, I think once a person leaves their comfort zone…once a person gets to their destination…and engages people of different cultures….it will spark a curiosity…sitting in a hostel, and seeing all the people plan their days…seeing them excited to see the cities they are respectively staying in…it will rub off on even those who only came for some alcohol and screwing.

Even if a traveller somehow manages to close his/her mind to their fellow travellers, they will be forced to acclimate by even doing the most simple of things i.e. buying a ticket for the metro…ordering breakfast etc. etc. etc.

Travelling will put them in position to be more open minded than if they sat on their asses back at home…where cross cultural dialogue will be inherently limited.

i think I agree more with Thomas Fuller:

"Travel makes a wise man better, and a fool worse"

I prefer the quote by Mark Twain..

"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness… broad, wholesome, charitable views cannot be acquired, by vegetating in one’s little corner of the earth."

All three of you (well, 4, including Mr. Miyagi ) make good points.
In the 18th and 19th centuries, aristocratic young Brits did the Grand Tour, now I suppose it’s fortunate North Americans. But these young people might well have earned the money with after school jobs.

acg912
You really don’t have to go to Europe to have a hell of a time after graduation, but if you want to go there, we can help you with your plan.
Is that 2500 dollars per person, per group, or what?
The Greek Islands would indeed provide culture as well as partying.
Maybe you could do a Greece/Italy trip.
Looked at any maps or guidebooks yet?

i think we tend to look at young kids and forget…or think we remember but we dont feeeeel what they feel …we just think we know what it should be like for them..

its hard to put ur partying shoes on when uve got a mortgage and kids
but u cant hurry anyone thru any stage of development …
my son still parties..at 20..less and less.but he does get wasted from time to time… i dont know what the point is, really ..that is, i have forgotten what the point was!
idont want him to ‘contiki’ his way thru europe and not be able to recall much cos of the partying
but hes funding this 12000 dollar ( aud) trip so …its his choice..

i agree, that partying on foreign land forges bonds..i am so looking forward to my son making contacts with the young people of europe and elsewhere..im looking forward to his stories

i dont think partying on ur own turf measures up…its like not going out for a coffee or never going to the movies cos u have a dvd and a jar of instant in the pantry

so party and party well…party sensibly so ur not taken advantage of and that u have some semblance of a brain the next day for seeing the sights..
be kind..be respectful.. be the best representative of ur country and spread the friendship..invite someone back to ur home..and maybe the friendships u make this time will last a lifetime
have a wonderful time!

i believe that you gentlemen have misinterpreted my intentions greatly. im not going soley for the &quotrivlage" drinking, i can drink here, there, anywhere. if any one of you think that high school students follow any drinking age, you are all very , very , very sadly mistaken. Its not an issue of finding a party here where i live, but deciding whether or not to go out at night.

my friends and i are going to europe, because we damn well feel like it. we all think that it would not only be a fun experience, but very interesting experience and we arent actively excluding any destination at all. What im looking for is advice to things you cant find in guide books, tourist websites, and brochures. I can look in some shitty guide book and read all about the ampitheater at rome, or the canals of venice; however, i cannot find in those paperback "end all " guides any advice on destintations that would have any meaning to me at all. We’re going to see the sights but we yearn for so much more.

sure, we want to get crunk and engage in all sorts of debauchery, but i can do that here as well. I want to go to different places in the one time in my life where i hold no responsibility, no attachments, and no dependencies.

All i was asking for was some god forsaken finger pointing to an interesting place to visit. Is that too much to ask? Are my motives not glorified enough for the elite "eurotrippers"? Am i not good enough to travel without "inspiration"? I was under the impression that this was a forum for help, for aid that might lead me and my merry band of friends to three astonishing, astounding, amazing weeks of completely heterosexual male bonding.

were you not once naive? were you not once implusive? were you not once innocent? Were you not once Young ?

-and by the way, you meet alot more people when you’re drunk .

I kind of have a question to add to this topic. If ur planning on going on a backpacking trip to europe just to see sigths and soak up the culture how much does the cost rise approximately when ur planning on seeing a few sights but mainly planning on partying? if it rises at all.

i weep for your jaded souls and the stone hearts which have replaced the once living, compassionate tissue.

Hey, I tried to stand up for you pal haha.

quote:we arent actively excluding any destination at all. What im looking for is advice to things you cant find in guide books, tourist websites, and brochures. I can look in some shitty guide book and read all about the ampitheater at rome, or the canals of venice; however, i cannot find in those paperback "end all " guides any advice on destintations that would have any meaning to me at all. We’re going to see the sights but we yearn for so much more.
All i was asking for was some god forsaken finger pointing to an interesting place to visit. Is that too much to ask? Are my motives not glorified enough for the elite "eurotrippers"?

That’s the spirit there, little Timmy! That’s what you should have said the first time—so you could have gotten advice about places to avoid.

However, you’re still not answering a question that I asked in order to be able to help. (Remember, you did say

quote:thanks for any help

in your OP). I feel like I offered you some valuable help. You either dismissed it or don’t want to hear it, because you didn’t refer specifically to what I offered. That makes me not want to help you any further. Remember, I also said,

quote:Don’t get me wrong—I think young travel is as much about the adventure and what you learn about yourself and others along the way—but without starting with even a basic plan, it will all quickly become unraveled and they won’t have a good first experience in Europe (IMHO).

You write very well for a (supposed) 17-18 year-old.

Best of luck.

thanks for your help/compliment don.

i get a little carried away sometimes

Fine manifesto, acg912.

Now back to the business at hand:
Does each of you have $2500? Or is that what you have as a group?
Don and I both had previously suggested Spain for culture and nightlife.

You’d find more of the same in plenty of other countries.

However, Mediterranean Europe has much to offer in terms of natural beauty, party atmosphere, and culture. Maybe your merry band could do a coastal Spain/southern France nothern/Italy route, and end up in Greece and/or Croatia. That’s a lot of ground to cover, but it’s quite doable: you could fly into Barcelona and fly out of Athens or Split.
If you are looking at 3-4 weeks, you might want to keep it at 3-4 countries. The reason I keep bringing up the subject of maps and guidebooks is so that, young and impulsive as you might be, you can at least figure out where to fly into; how to approach your trip.

You can, of course, leave it more open than that if you want, it’s just that at some point you have to fly home.

quote:
I kind of have a question to add to this topic. If ur planning on going on a backpacking trip to europe just to see sigths and soak up the culture how much does the cost rise approximately when ur planning on seeing a few sights but mainly planning on partying? if it rises at all.

Jiggins
A lot of the sights are free or at least inexpensive. But if you don’t do any research, you don’t know about any sights or cultural activities at all. This is where a good guidebook can be really helpful.

Hey acg912,
I would probably fly into London and see the sights here first. Great pubs, architecture, art (if that is your scene) and plenty of clubs! Be aware that the value of the pound is very high now (against the dollar) and things are very expensive here anyway.
I have never tried Eurail but I can recommend Busabout (just do a google search for it) I did this a few years ago when I came over to Europe from Australia (am still here after 5 years!). Met loads of great people, lots of good drinking, good food and sightseeing.
For me Spain is awesome, Barcelona and Madrid. Running of the Bulls is fantastic as well (make sure you run). Amsterdam yes thats cool in many ways. Munich, Hmaburg, Stockholm, Rome, Naples, Corfu. There are so many places that are fantastic and you have to factor in travel time and develop a plan. As you know most plans fall apart when they are implemented but it gives you an idea and it will always change throughout your trip.
Anyway, better get back to work. Let me know if you have any questions.

Mike

we have 2500 each.

spain sounds amazing and we’re planning on visiting for sure since we’ll be in time for the running.

are there any greek islands in particular?

best place to fly in/out of?

is venice overrated?

thanks a ton

> is venice overrated?

This is a hard question to answer. I say most definitely not, but I saw Venice in the winter when it was less crowded. I also did lots and lots of background reading, both before and after. So I have a pretty good sense of Venice as a real place with a fascinating history. If you have both substantial crowds and haven’t done any prep work, it’s quite possible you’ll think Venice overrrated.

quote:
we have 2500 each.

Then you are well set financially.

quote:
are there any greek islands in particular?

Santorini for incredible scenic beauty (and there plenty of partying in Fira), Ios for partying, Crete for history/partying.

quote:
best place to fly in/out of?

With the kind of money you have, I’d suggest doing open jaw.
Fly into Barcelona and out of Athens.

quote:
is venice overrated?

I liked it a lot more in my 40’s than I did in my 20’s.
The second time I went, it was early June, so there were plenty of tourists, but still I was enchanted. Hard to say what you’d think.

hmmmm

i see a lot of that almost daily..the exchange here, i mean

and it makes me sad and impotent and humbled and indignant ( just a little)

just makes me think more …so thanks acg… not sure what im thanking u for…i see ur side clearly..and i see mine …and i see somewhere in between but im still not sure how things should be approached…what u did..("fight back" as u probably saw it)…i wouldve liked to have done that back in my day ..but of course there wasnt the anonymity of the net and forums…

when are the oldies right and when are we wrong? when is it ok to stand up for urself and when is it not…still havent hatched a total egg of an opinion..

hormones is what we can attribute it to

i just finished reading some stuff about the brain …really interesting stuff and a must for all parents…about the development of the brain …

i think, sometimes, some people write very briefly…which is fine ..absolutely…but it can come across as a little dry or insensitive..even a teeny weeny bit superior… hey, im sure im guilty !!!just like emailing or communicating via sms can be misconstrued…add a measure of youthful pride ( nothin’ wrong with that, either..we have it for a reason,right?) and there’s an explosion

then everyone has to come around and sponge up the mess …and so we move on
acg…ull be clipping someone round the ear one day ( figuratively speaking) …again its all about hormones and ..i guess, pride lol
good luck and be safe

What does open jaw mean?

it means landing in one place on one side…and leaving from a place on another.

Side 1……………………………………………..Side 2.